[Fsfe-ie] Groklaw on patents in Europe.

[adam beecher]

All of which is great, but the fact remains that your attitude (in the case
of the Groklaw response) isn't conducive to reasonable discussion. If you're
just looking to rant without a response, then fair enough; but if you're
looking for someone to respond to you, that's not how to go about it.

This doesn't just apply to the F/S and/or O/S movements, it applies to
everything. Where would we be if it was considered ok to run up to someone
after they made a speech and tell them it was "terrible" in front of
everyone? Would you do that? I wouldn't, because it's rude.

Of course many F/S or O/S advocates aren't in fact look for reasonable
debate, they're looking for a fight. I'm not talking about you in particular
here, but in general about my perception of the movement. It's kinda
pathetic.

adam

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> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ian Clarke [mailto:ian at locut.us] 
> Sent: 23 August 2004 11:37
> To: adam beecher
> Cc: 'FSF Europe public discussion list for Ireland'
> Subject: Re: [Fsfe-ie] Groklaw on patents in Europe.
> 
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> On 23 Aug 2004, at 11:20, adam beecher wrote:
> > Ian,
> > Sorry to lecture, but this bugs the living doodoo out of me...
> >> This is a terrible idea...
> >>
> > When you want someone to listen to your opinion, telling them they 
> > have "terrible idea(s)" usually isn't a good way to start.
> 
> That is why I didn't, I said *this* is a terrible idea, not 
> that he has terrible ideas in general.
> 
> >  How would you respond
> > to someone that started a conversation with you like that?
> 
> Depends on whether what they were saying made sense or not.  
> If I think something is a terrible idea then I will say so.  
> I was criticising his idea, not him.  If he is too 
> thin-skinned to understand the difference, then he should 
> probably refrain from expressing his opinions in public forums.
> 
> In this case I assume that he can give as good as he gets, he 
> certainly doesn't hold back in his criticism of John Gray.
> 
> >  This kind of
> > offensive (as in "going on the") communication is a massive 
> issue for 
> > the Free Software and Open Source movements, in my opinion. 
> Wouldn't 
> > something like "I don't think this is a good idea" have been a much 
> > nicer way of kicking your feedback off? Or is "nice" passé now, cos 
> > Richard Stallman and Eric Raymond don't do it?
> 
> I tailor my response to what I am responding to.  If I 
> thought "I don't think this is a good idea" adequately 
> conveyed my strength of feeling on this issue then that is 
> what I would have said.  In this case he is advocating an 
> idea which IMHO seriously hurts the anti-patent cause, and I 
> do not apologise for criticising it in the strongest terms.
> 
> Ian.
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