[Free-RTC] Escape from PRISM!

[MJ Ray]

Emil Ivov <emcho at jitsi.org> [...stuff about STUN that's probably right...]
> > but that doesn't really help solve
> > my problem of having some way to call in/out that doesn't suck like
> > ippi did last time I looked (more expensive than a fixed line!)
> 
> I assume you are saying this in comparison with Skype, in which case I
> don't think what you are saying is accurate.

No, I've never installed Skype, although I've used a friend's client.
I'm comparing with fixed lines in the UK.  Compared to £10/month+calls
for that, ippi wants €10+tax/month for a virtual number, plus probably
€5+tax/month for calls if I understand its confusing pricing as it
applies to my use.  It'd be cheaper to get a fixed line but then I'd
have two incompatible phones on my desk with all the problems of that :-/

> Personally, I've been using them happily for a while now but I
> suppose prices depend on destinations and if the ones you are
> interested in tend to be more expensive with one provider, then just
> try another one. Or use several. That's the beauty of it all.

And for those who primarily want to make calls, that's the horror of
it all.  It's a pain having to test multiple providers for
compatibility and pricing, maybe giving several of them money and/or
bank card info with no assurance of decent service or a refund if they
suck.

Having the choice is good, once you know *something* reasonable will
work.

> There are numerous other options. OVH, onSIP,  sipgate ... I really
> think we can fill in a list of about a 100 within a day.

Please do!  That would be fantastic!  There used to be
voip-info.org/wiki but it seems to be full of ads and spam now,
doesn't cover XMPP and the other pages have become progressively less
useful.

Lists from trustworthy experts of what they know works, what should
work and what has those four features (SIP, TLS, ICE and DDI/POTS -
maybe XMPP and ENUM columns as encouragement?) would be very welcome!
That would be a great addition to any (all?) Free RTC websites.

I've really seen nothing like it - for example, lumicall says "Does it
work with DDI numbers from any VoIP provider?  If the VoIP provider
supports SIP, TLS and ICE, it should work" but does ANY provider say
they support those three on their website?  Trying your list:

ippi? Nope. Their javascript-infested FAQ is a mess of things like
@Q531@ and netiher it nor "SIP parameters" seem to mention TLS or ICE.

OVH.fr? Nope. The fiche technique doesn't mention TLS or ICE, just
"SIP IP". Searching guides.ovh.com finds nothing relevant.

onSIP? "the OnSIP service supports a broad range of SIP features and
functionality" but doesn't seem to spell out which ones.  Also looks
more expensive than fixed lines.  No results in its javascript search
for TLS.

sipgate?  Not obvious and "Search term "TLS" does not exist."

Generally, if the sites mention specific software, they seem to be
Windows and/or antiques.

I know this is the fault of those companies and not developers (it
looks like their marketing departments are mismanaging the websites,
omitting key info), but it makes it look like there might be no
support services available for the likes of lumicall and jitsi.  I've
been using VoIP for years and I can't tell.  Contacting possible
providers is time-consuming.  It's a very frustrating situation.

> Still, there's a major gotcha with POTS services: if your point was to
> escape surveillance as this thread suggests, then there is no way any
> kind of POTS termination could be a solution.

No, it's not a solution, but it is a necessary step towards a solution.

It's extrememly unlikely that everyone will adopt compatible free RTC
software at once.  It may even be good to flash up a "big brother may
be listening" warning to remind users of this if the software spots
them talking with a POTS bridge (numbers starting 00 maybe?), but
we're still going to have to do it at least occasionally for a while,
even if only to talk to the public sector.  Skype seem to understand
that POTS services are a useful selling point and potential revenue
source for now...  do free RTC developers?

Hope that explains,
-- 
MJ Ray (slef), member of www.software.coop, a for-more-than-profit co-op.
http://koha-community.org supporter, web and library systems developer.
In My Opinion Only: see http://mjr.towers.org.uk/email.html
Available for hire (including development) at http://www.software.coop/