FSFE projects [was: T-shirts]

[Gerhard Poul]

> > Sun, HP, and IBM have the same problem. - Nobody knows _anyhting_
> > about their Unix systems before someday sitting in front of one ;-)
> 
> The problem being common with non-free *nix's doesn't mean we shouldn't
> address it.

I don't say the FSFE shouldn't think about it.  But I tried to say that
the problems you pointed out are three completely different ones:

  - The students that leave universities have no knowledge of Unix.

  - Teachers and students are not aware that something else than 
    windows exists.

  - They don't know about free software.

I think the FSFE should think about both but should only invest
time in the third one.

I don't know which resources the FSFE has available but you have to
realize that you can't do everything alone.

> > If Unix User Groups don't address this issue maybe the FSFE should
> > promote the use of Unix. (either free or non-free)
> 
> NO! Promoting the use of non-free software? NO. It's a fact that when
> taught on the use of a GNU environment on is at the same thime taught
> on the use of non-free *nix. That's a side effect. Not the reason it
> is done.

ouch.... okay... what about this: Try to find out if commercial unix
vendors do/want to do something about this.  If they want to, why not
let them do that and maybe talk to the people working on that?
Many people use free software on commercial unix systems.

I just try to point out that in the first two points the FSFE _MIGHT_
have a common interest with the commercial unix vendors.

> > That's what I'm trying to prohibit. - If they learn Unix, regardless
> > of freeness, they will have _no_ problem of working with a GNU
> > system.
> 
> Yes, that's true. But not a reason to promote Unix use.

Well.  IMHO the GNU system was designed like Unix to make it easy for
people to use free software and to make it easy to port software to this
free platform.

> > >  - Developing free software to be used as a tool in any level of
> > >    education: primaire, high school, supérieur.
> 
> Oups, some french glided in here: primaire = 6 to 12 years old,
> supérieur = higher education (after high school graduation).
> 
> > I don't think free software works that way.
> 
> ? Why should the whole world use free software to do everything, but
> not education organizations? I really don't get your point here.

Maybe I didn't understand what you said. - You said the free software
community has to develop free software to be used as a tool in any level
of education.

IMHO free software best works if there is a direct relation between
problem/solution. - Someone has this problem -> they write software to
solve it.

In all other cases I don't think it works if someone is not paid for it.

If you pay someone it _will_ work with free software. - My answer was
much too generic.