Discussion September 2006

discussion@lists.fsfe.org

32 participants
20 discussions

FAQ for giving talks about Free Software
by Shane M. Coughlan 22 May '07

22 May '07

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 Hi guys I wanted to update you with regards the FAQ for giving talks about Free Software. There is a new section on the fellowship site for advocacy. At the moment you'll find the English version of the FAQ there. We also have the FAQ in the following languages: - - German - - French - - Spanish - - Italian - - Bulgarian Someone offered to do a Turkish translation and I'm waiting on that. I've also been cheeky and asked a Japanese friend to do a Japanese translation. Ditto Chinese Mandarin and Chinese Cantonese. The translations of the FAQ are waiting on an update to the followship CMS board system to allow all the characters to display properly. Now, regarding the advocacy section of the site: I want to add a lot more material there to help people spread the word about Free Software. Suggestions and material welcome! Regards Shane - -- Shane Martin Coughlan e: shane(a)opendawn.com m: +447773180107 (UK) +353862262570 (Ire) w: www.opendawn.com - --- OpenPGP: http://www.opendawn.com/shane/publickey.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2.2 (GNU/Linux) iQCVAwUBRNHjLtwG3M95JPpzAQio9wP+PcDlPsZcnc/U2nGXB0VHHdX7Pf8rGmdy jiWTPXFiOTjMMZ/G3HeHlkX1d3G6ojuNAFD6+RVtkp3CWtOLVCDXm4IPrhjEc1Nk 4hWosjy4xTJYNkx7cDc5eFNTCKW9CJPAanLwQpGrHQYY1r27BXyxsWkF1GNMCb5x kSGpJoL+8Wo= =WijR -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Re: Defining Free Software Business
by Ottavio Caruso 24 Jan '07

24 Jan '07

What about classifying businesses according to the Debian guidelines (main, contrib and non-free)? Businesses that deal with 100% free software (from development to production) will fit in the main section, the others in either contrib or non free. By the way, I remember somebody here telling me some time ago that the GBN was thrown a spanner from the outside. I can only see spanners from inside. Ottavio Caruso -- No individual replies, please! __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

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Ree: Kernel developers' position on GPLv3
by Ottavio Caruso 02 Oct '06

02 Oct '06

A few people wrote: > Their moto (sic!), inspired by their leader, is > >"Ideology > sucks". But ideology really sucks! What has ideology got to do with Freedom. I might not entirely agree with the OSI, but the way many people at the FSF intend freedom is very patronizing. I don't want to be told what freedom is, I'm old and mature enough to know it already. An active participant to this mailing list and representative of the FSFE once said the FSF is full of nutcases. Well, it might show up in such circumstances and won't buy me into your arguments. Having said that, I think the position of the Linux kernel developers is pathetic; if you don't like that license, don't use it and shut up. I don't see any incompatibilities between the kernel and the user space. Ottavio Caruso -- Please follow up to mailing list! __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

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The fellowship meeting in Italy
by Shane M. Coughlan 30 Sep '06

30 Sep '06

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 Hi guys Given that everyone is taking about why Free Software (and our new license) is a good idea...perhaps it's worth bringing up the fellowship conference that is going to happen shortly in Italy! As you may (or may not) know there is going to be a conference in Italy in November that will provide an excellent opportunity for everyone in the fellowship to sit down together and have a discussion. There are so many things to talk about. Right off the top of my head: (1) Positive advocacy and how do to it effectively (2) Ways to increase the fellowship in each country (3) Ways to help people feel more involved in the Free Software community One thing that I think would be interesting is to sit down with everyone and get a chance to know the faces behind the email address. The are people from all over Europe (and beyond) in the fellowship. I'm sure we have a great deal to say to each other. My personal 'hobby horse' topic is advocacy. Free Software is a great idea and I think it's so important to tell people why this is so. Through positive advocacy we can accomplish a great deal. I think the November conference will provide an excellent opportunity for us to share ideas and to work out new ways to get our message across. To find out more about the conference as a whole have a look at: http://www.sfscon.it/ To read more about the fellowship bit: http://www.fsfe.org/events/ To register have a look at: http://sfscon.it/registration Regards Shane -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2.2 (GNU/Linux) iQCVAwUBRRgKGdwG3M95JPpzAQhRBwQAq0NDAeIOQydkQtxLCTB3nh9J2HVGObnR QxdVbNdSrk513okIl06lE+qwteiK3kPVtYDPB8KB1ATg7Duo/+/NAkKQZVcRJzTm lkUUuoUo6w9B6q1TlSyNuUC+2yGEqD2LaIoKgVxbP3HJFoJGYd8sbcyxPKfjB4iF vNgIongNgMI= =odG+ -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Re: Kernel developers' position on GPLv3
by Bjoern Schiessle 28 Sep '06

28 Sep '06

Niall Douglas <s_sourceforge(a)nedprod.com> wrote: > They then go on to say that in their opinion, you can't write any wording > which wouldn't have unintended consequences and therefore you should drop > the attempt. That's going too far IMHO, but I do WHOLEHEARTEDLY agree that > the wording is FAR, FAR too vague. > For example, as far as I understood revision 2, it COULD be > incompatible with BSD licensing, The BSD Licence allows you to do everything you want with the software even to use it with a licence which allows you nothing, so how could it be incompatible with the GPLv3? > COULD be incompatible with authentication signing keys (ie; this > binary was made by me), I can't see how you can read this assumption out of draft 2 of GPLv3? Draf2 of GPLv3 says: "The Corresponding Source also includes any encryption or authorization keys necessary to install and/or execute modified versions from source code in the recommended or principal context of use, such that they can implement all the same functionality in the same range of circumstances." If you sign a program so that i know that the program comes from you i can "install and/or execute modified versions from source code in the recommended or principal context of use, such that they can implement all the same functionality in the same range of circumstances." So you don't have to give me your signing key. > COULD be incompatible with permitting GPL v3 binaries to be > transferred over a SSL connection etc. If you transfer something over SSL from person A to person B than person B will be able to execute and/or modify the code as permitted by the GPL. So i don't see how it could be prohibited by GPLv3. I would be interested to know how you came to such conclusions. Maybe you can quote some sections from draft2 of GPLv3 to back up your opinion? > And you know what happens next if the FSF doesn't stop? Yep, the kernel > developer's own 'enhancement' of GPL v2. I don't think so. I seems like the kernel hackers are quite happy with their licence (GPLv2) and remember, they would need the approval from all contributors to change the licence. Cheers, Bjoern -- Bjoern Schiessle http://www.schiessle.org Nobody can save your freedom but YOU - become a fellow of the FSF Europe! (https://www.fsfe.org)

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Anti-DRM event in Central London this Saturday
by Simon Morris 27 Sep '06

27 Sep '06

[Apologies to the subscribers of fsfe-uk. You will have seen this already] Hello, On this Saturday 30th September there is a anti-DRM event in Central London. http://defectivebydesign.org/en/actions/oct3/apple_store_regent_street_lond… As with the previous DefectiveByDesign events this will be a HAZMAT suit parade.. http://www.flickr.com/groups/defectivebydesign/pool/ .. which should be colourful, fun and I hope we can get our message about restrictive technology and it's problems across to the general public. The event is outside of the Apple Store on Regents Street starting at 1400 until 1700. I hope to see some of you there! Thanks -- ~sm Jabber: sm(a)jabber.fsfe.org www: http://beerandspeech.org

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RE: Kernel developers' position on GPLv3
by Sam Liddicott 27 Sep '06

27 Sep '06

I should have been more clear, I was trying to avoid being rude to ams. It was a truncation of a longer response where I was saying that ams should not have kept out of politics. I meant that the participation methods of FSF act as a selector of participants thus rendering ams conclusion meaningless, and supporting you. Sorry not to have been clear enough. Regards, Sam -----Original Message----- From: "MJ Ray" <mjr(a)phonecoop.coop> To: discussion(a)fsfeurope.org Sent: 26/09/06 17:57 Subject: Re: Kernel developers' position on GPLv3 Sam Liddicott <sam(a)liddicott.com> wrote: > * Alfred M. Szmidt wrote, On 26/09/06 13:34: > > You say that simply because you cannot use it how _you_ want, the > > whole system must be junked, you could simply install a webbrowser and > > use the system, or a PDF viewer, all of this is free software and not > > very hard to do. Firstly, I have a couple of web browsers installed, including Firefox, but they do not work with the system. Secondly, web browsers are too large to download over GSM, I don't even have a telephone landline at the moment (thanks BT) and I can't see how to download stuff to removable media on the public library computers. I say it should be junked simply because it makes various undocumented particular software demands, instead of using widely-available accessible tools. > > PDF viewers and web browsers are the most basic > > tools these days. PDF viewers are more basic than text editors, eh? > > Maybe if you paid the people who made the whole GPLv3 commenting > > infrastructure you might get what you want, but until then, they are > > going to work on something the majority of people can use easily, and > > they have done a wonderful job achiving that IMHO. If FSF needs help or funding to get a working comment system, they should ask for it in good time. I'd chip in and I'm sure many others would too, but I would not pay the people who made the current inaccessible system. > I also believe that most of those who have been able to participate have > been satisfied with the participation tools. That's not really surprising, is it? Thanks, -- MJ Ray - see http://mjr.towers.org.uk/email.html Somerset, England. Work: http://www.ttllp.co.uk/ IRC/Jabber/SIP: on request _______________________________________________ Discussion mailing list Discussion(a)fsfeurope.org https://mail.fsfeurope.org/mailman/listinfo/discussion

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Re: Kernel developers' position on GPLv3
by Stefano Maffulli 27 Sep '06

27 Sep '06

Hello Niall, your statements are extremely important and deserve attention because GPLv3 cannot afford leaving ambiguity or generate incompatibility with what you say below. On Tue, 2006-09-26 at 09:04 +0100, Niall Douglas wrote: > For example, as far as I understood revision 2, it COULD be > incompatible with BSD licensing, COULD be incompatible with > authentication signing keys (ie; this binary was made by > me), COULD be incompatible with permitting GPL v3 binaries to be > transferred over a SSL connection Can you please point out the precise wordings that in your opinion could lead to such incompatibilities? I couldn't see these problems (although I found others and submitted comments). Did you submit your comments? thanks stef

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1st draft of GNU FDL 2.0
by Yavor Doganov 26 Sep '06

26 Sep '06

Just some minutes ago, the FSF announced the publication of the first discussion draft for version 2 of the GNU FDL: http://www.fsf.org/news/gfdl-dd1.html

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Discussion draft of new GNU Free Documentation License released
by Alfred M. Szmidt 26 Sep '06

26 Sep '06

The following just poped up at http://www.fsf.org, I haven't had a chance to read the draft yet though. Discussion draft of new GNU Free Documentation License released BOSTON, September 26, 2006--The Free Software Foundation (FSF) today released the first discussion draft for version 2 of the GNU Free Documentation License (GFDL). In addition to being the official documentation license of the GNU Project, the GFDL is used by many other free documentation projects, including Wikipedia. Accompanying this revision release of the GFDL is a new companion license, called the GNU Simpler Free Documentation License (GSFDL). This release marks the beginning of a public discussion and review process, with the goal being the production of the best free documentation licenses possible. The FSF has invited everyone to read the new drafts and contribute comments at http://gplv3.fsf.org/doclic-dd1-guide.html. The new license texts have wording intended to improve internationalization, to allow for easier excerpting and distribution, and to be more clear about their application to media formats other than text. Documentation licenses exist because free manuals are essential for free software. But the GFDL and GSFDL are not limited to software documentation. While the FSF recommends these licenses "principally for works whose purpose is instruction or reference," they state clearly in Section 0 of each license that each can be used for "any work of authorship meant for human appreciation, rather than machine execution." The GFDL 1.1 was released in 2000. It was revised and released in 2002 as version 1.2. Media contact: Brett Smith Compliance Engineer Free Software Foundation 617-542-5942 brett(a)fsf.org About the FSF The Free Software Foundation, founded in 1985, is dedicated to promoting computer users' right to use, study, copy, modify, and redistribute computer programs. The FSF promotes the development and use of free (as in freedom) software--particularly the GNU operating system and its GNU/Linux variants--and free documentation for free software. The FSF also helps to spread awareness of the ethical and political issues of freedom in the use of software. Their Web site, located at www.fsf.org, is an important source of information about GNU/Linux. Donations to support their work can be made at http://donate.fsf.org. Their headquarters are in Boston, MA, USA Created by johns Last modified 2006-09-26 02:08 PM

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Discussion September 2006