<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 TRANSITIONAL//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>
<META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; CHARSET=UTF-8">
<META NAME="GENERATOR" CONTENT="GtkHTML/3.6.2">
</HEAD>
<BODY>
Ricardo,<BR>
<BR>
I agree very much with your <FONT COLOR="#000000">offtopic opinion, not european or american view, about terrorism and uk</FONT>.<BR>
By simple logic of definition, Bush and Blair are two of the most dangerous terrorists today, using brute force to obtain the natural resources of other countries.<BR>
<BR>
War IS terrorism.<BR>
<BR>
Stian<BR>
<BR>
On fr , 2005-07-29 at 14:42 -0300, Ricardo Andere de Mello wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>
<PRE>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">Hi,</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">I'm brazilian, and we felt very sad here because of the recent uk police </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">killing the brazilian guy. I'm a little worried because a very close </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">friend is going next week to work in London (fashion market), and I know </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">there is this "terrorist atmosphere in London", and since she dont speak </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">english very well, I think she can have problems just for being a foreigner.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">I going to talk now about another topic but you will later notice that </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">it is related to this topic.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">Spams are some of the more annoying things in the world. I really hate </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">them. What is the only reason they still exist? I'm asking this because </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">if we use the technology we have, we can really stop spams. The reason </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">is that the only effective way to stop spam would break de anonymity of </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">the email. See, the Internet has grow with anonymity as a foundation and </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">breaking this foundation would take us to virtual imprisonment.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">We would be cows in a field, each one with his mark, and would be no </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">place to escape.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">Cryptography tools in a free knowledge world works only for:</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">1 - guarantee identity</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">2 - keep anonymity</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">The funny thing is that these things contrapose.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">Recently I've read a detailed paper about how China controls it's </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">Internet. Part of this system is not allowing any kind of anonymous </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">access. If you enter at a cyber cafe, you must show your identity card, </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">and everything you do will be logged and stay at the cyber cafe for at </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">least one month. All internet providers are from government and they </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">need id too.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">If you are against the regime in China, of course you can try to use </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">stenography to communicate to the outside world, but it still easy to </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">get caught, because they can't read your message, but they can detect </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">cryptography messages related to your id, and this is enough to get you.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000"><my offtopic opinion, not european or american view, about terrorism and uk></FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">I'm very worried about using the word "terrorist". See, terrorists are </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">guys that attacks "civilian" targets. I think it is complicated to talk </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">about this when a country is in war with another. Should they, when </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">seeing all your aircraft and guns, just say: "ok, we will fight using </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">your rules."???</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">War is wrong, but it is a fallacy saying that there is any ethic in a </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">way to practice war. UK should have learned this in usa independence </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">war, that it lost because of some guerrila techniques.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">I really doubt UK would have any "terrorism" if it dont entered in </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">iraque's war. When usa and uk shoot people in streets in iraque they are </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">considered "war casualties". Saddam is not there anymore, why are they </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">still there? Fucking oil.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">uk is just paying the price of the oil, fear.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">"civilians" are citizens, and responsible for each government act. </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">They've ellected their politician, so they would naturally suffer from </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">their decision.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000"></my offtopic opinion, not european or american view, about terrorism </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">and uk></FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">Sorry for exposing my opinion here, this is really offtopic to the list, </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">but since it is a european list, I think you would like to know how we </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">are seeying these things here. Anyway, we have more things to worry </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">here, there are more deaths here because of street violence that in </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">iraque's war...</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">[]s, gandhi</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">Simon Morris wrote:</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>On Fri, 2005-07-29 at 11:11 +0100, Jeremiah Foster wrote:</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">></FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">></FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">> </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">></FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>>Not true. If you had a key recovery mechanism, you could quickly</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>>recovery the key and encrypted information, thus potentially saving</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>>lives. Look at the situation today, the police suspect another attack</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>>with innocent people killed is imminent, oughtn't there be a mechanism</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>>to prevent this needless death?</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>> </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>></FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">></FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>To me that last statement smacks of "think of the children".</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">></FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>Yes - we should be taking action against terrorists and preventing</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>needless deaths - how would key escrow help here?</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">></FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>Giving away our freedoms isn't necessarily going to help law enforcement</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>intercept communications. Other mechanisms exists to pass information</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>around and plan criminal activities - stenography for example.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">></FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>To be honest one of the reasons that we managed to decrypt the Enigma</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>machine 60 years ago was because we captured a device and the German</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>operators were too confident in it's abilities. What if the terrorist</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>had a similar "low tech" method?</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">></FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>If I send a letter through the post I'm fairly sure it isn't read by law</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>enforcement officials... there are many different ways to communicate</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>and if the government start pushing for escrow here I'd be a bit</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>suspicious</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">></FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>~sm</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>_______________________________________________</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">>Discussion mailing list</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">><A HREF="mailto:Discussion@fsfeurope.org">Discussion@fsfeurope.org</A></FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">><A HREF="https://mail.fsfeurope.org/mailman/listinfo/discussion">https://mail.fsfeurope.org/mailman/listinfo/discussion</A></FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">> </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#000000">></FONT>
</PRE>
</BLOCKQUOTE>
</BODY>
</HTML>